Randall Carlson, thank you for joining me. How are you doing? Doing well. Well, thanks for having me. Well, a lot of

people right now are wondering, wow, this is the moment. So, for people who are not caught up to speed, about a year

ago, January of 2024, there was a letter to Ashton Forbes that was posted on

YouTube. And I want to play part of that letter right now.

Let's have a listen.

our problem. Then came you. Hi, Ashton.

Impressive. This is what I want to leave you with. There was a guest on the Joe

Rogan podcast that was talking about sacred geometry and some new technology his friends had discovered on some

island somewhere. He did record another episode, but never been published.

Doesn't the wording sacred geometry remind you of something? If you choose to spend time on this, which I think you

should instead of mall aliens, keep in mind that your case is one product of

the technology. What happens on the other island, you will understand this if you pursue it, is another more

rudimentary product. What if those in combination could lead you right path to

the actual technology? The gray bearded man is the key and he probably has no

idea that he is. Finally, I want to say this. How do you defeat someone who can

turn skyscrapers to dust? Completely erase whole neighborhoods in an afternoon and steal a burning Boeing 7

midair. Someone who when needed has the complete control of all media and crafts

the perception of events and has most of humanity eating from its hands. After

almost a full life in their service, I think I know the answer. You talk about them and you don't stop talking.

Well, okay. What a way to start. Well, yeah, what a way to start. Um, so

let me say this right off the bat is that the other context of that is it's a letter about what happened to that

Malaysian airline flight 370 and it's been it was praising the

investigative research I had done up until that point about 6 months of research and it was telling me that we

have this like plasma technology and at the time I didn't know anything really about it and after that I watched

watched some clips that you had that had gone viral, I think on either Sean Ryan

or Joe Rogan or both, and you were talking about plasma technology and I

started looking into it and I went, "Wow, that's that was apparently talking about you and Malcolm Bendle and I found

Bob Greener talking about low energy nuclear reactions and all this stuff and it just seemed very weird." And now

we're a year later and I'm 100% convinced it's all about plasma

technology. So I want to get ask you one question right off the bat is the same

question they asked me which is what does sacred geometry remind you of in

there because when I they that letter that question was asked to me I I don't know a donut. What does it remind you

of? Well a donut. Yeah. you're talking about a Taurus and a Taurus geometry

seems to be integral to the whole operation of plasmoids because for whatever reason plasmoids seem to prefer

a too toidal geometry and when you have a means and and and I always am

reluctant to try to talk too much about this because I'm really only in the first grade level of understanding

plasma science but I've seen enough personally firsthand to know that it's real. Okay. So, I've also seen enough to

know that other people who know more about it than I do are scratching their heads trying to figure out what in the

world they're witnessing. Uh, so it's not really so much a question of uh how

does it work. It's uh it it the question is yeah, it works. Now, we're trying to figure out how it works. And what it

seems is that it it it comes down to frequencies. uh certain frequencies seem

to be effective in somehow triggering this self-organization amongst a a random

chaotic plasma stream somewhere that it's in that range

of things where where my understanding is still relatively vague. Hopefully if you talk again in six months I'll have a

clearer understanding of it. But but it's in that range of phenomena where

you go from an incoherent disorganized chaotic stream of plasma which is just

disorganized electrons and ions and then under certain frequencies it seems to

almost assume an intelligence of its own and it begins to cohhere into these

organized systems and it seems it prefers certain ratios over others.

And the other thing that's it also seems is that many of those ratios are the very ratios we find embedded in the and

I'll use quotes sacred geometry from various cultures through various epochs

of history. Now whether they were somehow utilizing those uh those ratios

uh in the service of plasma energy I don't know but it is a coincidence if in

a way because so many of the uh the ratios proportions that we find within

again I'm going to use quotes sacred structures right sacred structures seems

to have this correlation with with geometry and I mean we can look at a few

examples if you want Um, we can look at them in a second here. Let me start though with one thing I uh, you know,

baby steps because I want to get to all of what you just mentioned. But what was the thing that got you to even look at

plasmas? Like what triggered you on that? Because for me, I just I never even thought about just like, oh, that's just something physics people look into,

you know, like what got you realize there's something more there? Oh, well, I was interested in it from

years ago. I read a book on entitled uh I think was plasma the fourth state of

matter uh and that had to have been early 80s so it was one of those things

that kind of gestated in my mind for a long time without any act proactive

studies to get behind it and then I'm guess we're going back about 10 years ago and I I got a call from Malcolm

Bendle um who had been working on uh several devices that that were based

upon plasma energy And basically what he told me was that he had seen a video where I was giving a

lecture on sacred geometry and the and the essence of it was that he found that certain

geometric ratios built into the literal devices into the machines were made it

more effective in in making this transformation from disorganized plasma

streams into organized plasmoids. And in this uh in this uh video that he saw, I

was giving a lecture somewhere. I don't even know where it was. It was a lecture on sacred geometry. And I was talking about the consistent use of certain

proportions throughout all of these uh structures through history and around the globe that generally we would define

as being sacred in the sense that they were temples or places of worship or churches, cathedrals, things like this.

and uh I was pointing out these consistent geometries and he contacted me to tell me that those were the same

geometries he was finding effective in building these plasma machines. Wow. So at that point I was like, okay, because

in the back of my mind I'm going, okay, I know that if you use these particular ratios and proportions in in a in a

building, in architecture, but not only in architecture, but in art and in music, in multiple realms where you're

trying to manifest something within within the realm of of physics, the physical uh domain, right? So, one of

the things that seemed to be one of the like secrets, for example, of Renaissance art, as well as many of the

uh ancient traditions, the Greeks apparently knew this, the Egyptians definitely did. Megalithic builders seem

to use it. We've even find the monumental earthwork architecture in North America, particularly the

pre-Colombian stuff that disappeared long not long after the Europeans

arrived, all seem to be based upon the same geometric template. And it's a few

basic forms, but from those forms, you can get a a multiplicity of of varants.

And so those particular forms were what he was finding seemed to be most efficacious when it came to uh building

these devices. So let me say that what's crazy about that is that earlier on the letter there a part I didn't play. It

talks about how this technology is based off simple monor structures and that

like basically adding to the structure then allows it to have a different function implying that they can use it

for infinite energy teleportation all kinds of things that we would think are like magical. Now the letter and the

part that I did play also said you know that Randall Carl the grey beard man's

the key and he probably doesn't even know that he is. And I was going to ask you what he means by that, but if he's

right, you probably wouldn't know. But I think you just answered it. I think you just answered it. There's something I

want to tell you that might help you out is that Einstein won the Nobel Prize for the photoelectric effect, which showed

that light is a photon, a packet of waves. And they did that because they

shine light on metal. And when they increase the brightness, they didn't see

an increase of energy from the electron. So it wasn't like a ball hitting another ball. That's not the reaction that they

saw. The reaction they saw was like more balls got released, but they h didn't have more energy if you increase the

brightness. And and instead what they found is that okay, if they want to increase the kinetic energy, they don't

change the brightness of the light, they change the color, they change the frequency of the light. Mhm. And

Einstein won the Nobel Prize. And ever since we've now believed that light is a particle and a wave, but it's not.

Light's just a wave. And the answer to the photoelectric effect is resonance. It's frequency. It's what you just said.

It's not that light's a little packet and you need to have the right size packet. It's that you need to be tuned

in to the right frequency because everything is waves. And so then if

that's true, then the answer to a lot of stuff out there, including plasma, is

probably sacred geometry and ratios. And that's why I want to talk to you tonight. So first official question then

is in the context of that ancient history you were talking about. What do

you think the most spec most important geometric patterns are that you see you

know encoded throughout structures nature whatever

well I think it's it's hard to assign a priority because each one have plays a

different role. Um clearly all the polygonal forms the regular polygons are

important. Uh we find them you know in growth ratios in crystallin structures.

Um in this spacing the uh spacing ratios of planets.

Um I would say start with the the polygons. Start with a simple square, a

simple um you know uh well you've got an equilateral triangle being about the

simplest form that you can actually enclose space with um which would be an

equilateral triangle with three edges the same length. And that's produced by

a simple geometric operation that requires just laying out a circle. I should have had my

implements here at hand so I could have shown. I think we understand. My followers are very familiar with the equilateral triangle formation in

closing space. Yeah, go ahead. If you have a circle, you draw a circle and

then you draw another circle with the same radius such that the center of the

second circle falls on the circumference of the first, you get this thing. It looks like a vin diagram. It's an

overlap. Um, and it's called the vesicopiscus or the vessel. Yes. Uh and

its length to width ratio is in the square root of three to one. And that's a very interesting ratio. Uh it's it's

an irrational number very much like pi in that it if you put up three and square root it in your calculator. In

fact, I do have a calculator right here. And you put in three. Let's see if I can we can actually see this.

There it is. Three. On my screen, it's backwards, but hopefully it's not backwards on your screen. Right. So, I

just push the square root button and I get

1.732050808 and and and that's that's a a non-re repeating non-terminating decimal. Uh so it's an irrational

number. But the interesting thing about it uh is that this ratio is related to

another series of uh we call them dynamic ratios like for example the diagonal of a square to its side which

it doesn't matter what size those circles are that you generate the vesica with. The ratio of length to width is

always going to be the same. It doesn't matter what size your square is. The ratio of diagonal to side is will always

be the same. It'll be a constant. Right? Well, it turns out that if you simply using Pythagorean theorem, you can take

a right triangle and if it's two sides are equal, then it's di and and you uh

ascribe the value of unity to one of those sides, the diagonal be the square root of two. And I started out years

ago. I worked many years as a carpenter. And one of the very first things I learned was the uh the 17 to12 rule,

which because carpenters, if they're going to lay out and builders have done this literally, it it it goes back

centuries if not millennia. If you have a a ruler and it's or you measure a

square and it's 12 in on a side, the diagonal will be 16.97 something inches, which in round

numbers is 17. Now, if you're building a house, the ratio of 17 to 12 is close

enough to 16.97 to 12 that it does that little bit of 3100s of an inch doesn't

matter. Right? So, the 1712 rule was something I learned long ago that the that the diagonal of a square to its

side was almost 17 to 12. But then if you want to refine it, it's 16.97. Well, okay. So, now here's the

thing. If you what they did was they had a system where you could start with a square and I've taught this many times

but in Egypt the basic unit of measurement was called the reman and it was about equal to uh 14 something in of

our inches and if you were to draw a square that's one reman on a side its

diagonal will be the royal cubit which is well has been known since Isaac Newton's days uh he discovered it from

his uh analysis of the dimension of the king's chamber and the great pyramid but it's well known the royal cubit you can

look it up it's about I think it's uh about 20.6265 6265 in. Uh so taking a

square that's one reman on a side which is your basic unit. It's diagonal then is the royal cubit. Now they're

incommensables right? These numbers are incommensable. You can have one whole reman but you will not have a whole

number of royal cubits. Or vice versa. You can ascribe a whole number an

integral value to the to the diagonal but then the side of the square will be

irrational. it will not have however when you go from one dimension into two

dimensions and you're talking about area now you get perfectly commensurable because one square royal cubit is

exactly two square remans now if you take a rectangle and you draw it so that

let's say you start with a rectangle and its short side is the reman and its long side is the royal cubit it's diagonal

is going to be uh the square root of three the same value you get with that

vesica construction. Now there it turns out there was a prominent use of measure

sometimes according to some traditions it was the unit of measure used to build king Solomon's temple. I don't know

about that. I there's I haven't seen proof of that but it was alleged that that's what was used. But there was a

cubit called the Palestinian cubit. And the Palestinian cubit was the square

root of three times the reman coincidentally. Now the the reman and the royal cubit were you being used

during way back into the old kingdom 4,500 years ago. The Palestinian cubit

was being used about uh a th000 BC. So about 3,000 years ago. Yet they're

related geometrically in that because of that same ratio we call it the dam

dynamic symmetry the Palestinian cubit and the reman are incommensurable in in linear

but in area then the Palestinian cubit is exactly three re square remen in area

which is interest and and it goes on the system is actually much more involved than that but you seem to have this

integration of these ancient many of the ancient units of measurement often times

the ones that are associated with sacred structures and I use this without

defining what we mean by sacred structure um obviously you know we would

think traditionally it's a place where people go to worship or whatever I think we can take that to another uh a level

and say that maybe we could uh discuss the possibility that ultimately what defines a sacred space or a sacred

structure is the components of its design and the materials used and the

geometry integral to the structure. Um, so let me ask a couple questions cuz

first I like I think that from a physics perspective, the reason why sacred

geometry is important is that we think we live in a three-dimensional world and

even when we look at electromagnetism, we use the right hand rule which basically creates a uh orthogonal uh

cube like structure. That's how we experience our reality. And so you those

are your three axes right there. Yeah. So it makes sense that you would imagine that shapes there certain shapes are

going to be significant in the structure of our reality and how we build stuff in our reality. And then I guess the

question would be do did the ancients potentially know something about you

know physics or science more than we potentially give them credit for. And I

guess I want to know your opinion on before we get to that cuz I want to I do

want to know more about the ancient history and technology. But do you think crop circles are connected to some of

this like sacred geometry stuff? And when you say is sacred geometry, I

didn't know this. Is it because these geometries are found in sacred sites? Is that where the terminology actually

comes from? And could crop circles be a sacred site? Go ahead. Well, yeah. The

first place I the earliest place I can recall encountering the term sacred geometry was in a uh uh he was a uh his

architectural historian Freemason and he was well um in he was uh wellversed in

the in the studies of geometry particularly being used throughout architecture and he used uh he had a two

volume set uh that was on primarily on the geometry of churches and cathedrals

in the Middle Ages. And he used the term sacred geometry throughout. Uh so the

title of the book I could actually it's right back there on the shelf. I could go get it. We could look at it. But it was it was beautiful foldouts with all

of the geometries of juxtaposed on not only the ground plans of cathedrals but

the elevations as well. And there was a consistent set of geometry. it involved

uh repetitive use of the same ratios that I was just describing and that was I I have not been able to really find

where it was used before that. Um but it's been used redundantly since then

and has come to have its own meaning now and variations of meaning. Um I'm kind

of right trying to redefine it I guess in a way to be uh a little bit more

scientifically specific that there is something actually measurable and quantifiable that's going on there

rather than just oh yeah I went to this space and I felt really good and I

having visited a lot of spaces I can actually attest that yeah there seems to be some spaces where I felt really good

while I was there you know and then I walked out and had this sense of energy or whatever. Um, and you know, I've

talked to many many people over the decades and and heard that many times. I don't know, you know, how much is

objective and how much is subjective? But in my case, I'd say it's both. Um,

uh, so then the question in my mind is okay, is there something actually tangible that can be measured? Is there

something that we can actually quantify that's happening that affects the human nervous system in some way or your your

your your state of mind? And I think the answer is probably yes. There there is some way that it does that. Now on a

very mundane level we could say well there are certain ratios that seem to uh

you know embody a sense of harmony. And a big part of uh like in when I studied

ancient Greek architecture and statuary what I kind of came upon was

this idea of scale and variance. This idea that of well the modern term is self similarity. So that within a

composition whether it's a building whether it's a a statue later on you know paintings there are certain

relationships between the parts and the whole they may not even be detectable or

perceivable by the the conscious mind but they're somehow still affecting your

your perceptions of of these things because there is this relationship

between the part and the whole and and then that gets us back I think to the word you used earlier Ashton which is

resonance. Um somehow if you can take a let's say if you're going to do a

painting and you're going to incorporate sacred geometry, you determine the ratios of your canvas and then there are

certain rules and techniques by which you can divide it up so that the parts

somehow will reflect the the the proportions of the original. And that seems to be key in in many different

manifestations of sacred art and architecture and things around the world

is that particular relationship. And uh you know we can see it in the in the uh

the the relationships between the basic polygons because you know the polygons will start out that you've got uh

essentially five shapes that you can uh have all the sides the same and all the

angles the same. And the simplest is the equilateral triangle. Then you get to the square and then you get to the

pentagon and then which is a five-sided. And then of course if you go to the

six-sided you're just basically repeating that's a repetition of equilateral triangles. Well so let me

ask do you think crop circle stuff do you think people are like that's somebody trying to send us a message cuz

I mean whether or not you believe wherever the crop circles are coming from like clearly have sacred geometry

and then people point it out all the time. Do you think that oh yes thoughts on that on that whole phenomenon? Well,

my thoughts on sacred geometry, I mean, I'm sorry, on the crop circles are that

there's studies I could pull up I have some of those studies right here on my uh I could pull up probably. But yeah, I

the basic, you know, I'm generally familiar with the kind of overall like how you tell the real ones from the fake

ones with the, you know, how they've been broken or if they're just bent and stuff like that, like the bending of

them, which I think is really cool. Um, so do you think though that like uh

you know aliens or another civilization are making them or do you think they they might be coming just from some

enthusiast of uh sacred geometry? Well, let me let me put it this you know I

would start with AAM's razor and say okay it's people humans doing it. Okay. So then let's just let's just take that

apart. Let's unpack that and look at that and see what that implies. You look at some of these crop circles are

incredibly complex. Now, you know, I've been a builder. We build things and

before we build something, if let's say I'll just we're going to build a house and let's say it's I've built some

pretty complicated houses, you know, complicated footprints and so on. Well, the first thing you have to do is you go

out and you level the site, right? first thing you do because if you're going to get a if if your sight's not level, it's

almost impossible, very difficult to get right angle corners and get proper

angles between the sides and all that. So, and even if it's not all one level,

it's you you step it, but each level. Uh, okay. So, you're you're first of all, you're looking for a level site.

Okay. Now you do your surveying and you lay out the the what you do is you you you use are called batter boards and you

set up and you lay out the building. The way we do it is we'll we'll find the corners of the building and we'll drive

a stake at that point and then in top of that wooden stake there's a wooden stake. You put a little finish nail

little that's literally only a sixeenth of an inch wide. You put that finish nail in and that marks that'll be your

first step and then that's your datim point. Everything refers back to that, right? And it doesn't matter you're

laying out a simple square, rectangle, or into a a multi-sided polygon, doesn't matter. You start with a datam point and

everything refers back to that. Right? Now, from there, you have to we we will

set let's say every corner, whether it's an outside corner or an inside corner, will be marked with a stake, and it will

have its own little finish nail marking that exact point. Right? Then you run

lines right around that. You run uh builder's lines are called or mason's

lines. So that now you've got string that marks out your whole pattern on the ground. Right? So then if you go to

excavate or do whatever, the next thing we would do is we usually will excavate

um trenches that are the footings. But let's say we're going to try to do this as a crop circle. Well, here's the

thing. I can go out there and we'll lay out a house. We'll go out there. We we're using a transit. Uh we're using,

you know, maybe 150 foot fiberglass tape and we'll spend the better part of a day

out there laying out a fairly simple pattern on the ground. Right now, if

somebody said to me, "Well, here here's this picture of this crop circle, and it's this amazingly complex geometry.

Could you go out and create this in the field?" And I would say, well, I probably I've never tried doing that

before. Uh, but I could give it a shot. However, if you give me this pattern and

I'm going to recreate that pattern in the field, I don't just take I don't just go out there with a couple of guys

and some boards and some rope in the middle of the night in the dark and in the morning when I leave, here's this

incredible pattern on the ground. No, that ain't going to happen. You know, give me a month. Give me a couple of

months maybe. Right. Well, so what does this bring us? I mean, so you know the

implausibility of that. Okay. So if I was going to do that and try to do it

effectively, what I'd have to do is I'd have to have a warehouse somewhere. I'd have to get together a team and we would

have to lay out this like a full scale of the pattern. And then we would have

to rehearse and rehearse and rehearse. So everybody knew exactly what to do

where because we don't have a week. We don't have three weeks or a month to do this. We have to do it in one night. We

have to get out to the site. Nobody can see us. We can't get caught. We have to get out there in the dark, get this

thing done, and get the hell out of there before the sun comes up. right now. The only way I could even begin to

conceive how you would do something like that again is if you had a place and you know I never took part in them myself

but they used to have these contests where you know trying to like build a house in one day. Yeah. So yeah you get

a crew out there and they build a house in a day. However preceding that day of building that house are three or four

months of practice and rehearsal over and over your timing your tempo everything. And you could say so where

is that happening? Yeah, you could say like, oh, well, it's like a flash mob, but like where are the videos, too? It's

We live in a Tik Tok age. Nobody's recording any themselves like making any of these things, you know? It's like no

videos. That's the part where like I'm with you where it's I use I say, "Okay, I'm looking for a normal explanation,

but like where are these mysterious crop circle builders that go in the middle of the night and get these things up and

you know what what technology they using?" Seems complicated, but to change, let me ask, go ahead. Let me ask

you. So, so you mentioned flash mobs, which is interesting because is that like somebody saying, "Oh, well, it's

like a flash mob." Okay. So, but here's the thing. A flash mob, like my kid was

in a flash mob once upon a time and they rehearsed and rehearsed and rehearsed and rehearsed again to get it right and

they still didn't get it right. Exactly. But, so if you tell me, "Oh, it's a

flash mob." Okay. Well, that's what I'm saying. Yeah, it would have to be a flash mob. But they're not going to go

out there willing. Here's a p Oh, here's a nice p pattern. We draw it on this piece of paper. Then they sneak out

there at night in the dark and then next morning there it is perfectly recreated in the in the in the grainery. No, that

that just doesn't make sense. No, I'm with you. And there's even crazier ones that like were done in the daytime where

they can like narrow down the period of time to an hour. So, I think there it might be a message. And on the same

topic or on a similar topic, well, first of all, I want to say about scale and variance. That's a very huge point you

made about scale and variance. I think that well for the people out there that don't know just means that what is small

can be made to be big like things and it'll function and it'll act the same way. So what this means in theory is

that even an atom can be scaled up to something very large. Mhm. And I think

the connection there is something called Bose Einstein condensate, which is

basically making atoms act coherent, super fluidic, as though they're acting

as one overall structure. Mhm. Now I I've read a lot or some papers um about

how they've been able to stabilize the plasmas and there it seems to be that

they use this vertical motion is one option and another way is like a squeezing a plasma and that's how they

can make these ball lightnings like stable so they don't just dissipate and in the laboratory.

Yeah. In the laboratory to make ball lightning artificial. Yes. Artificially produced. Okay. Yeah. Uh, and so they

figure it out. If they do the math, they just run the numbers. They can figure out, oh, the plasma is creating its own

electromagnetic fields. And if we move the plasma around the right way, we can, you know, cancel out these

fields. And then we can if we have this either vertical motion or squeezing type

state happen that it will do what you said in terms of the waves, it creates a standing wave. the standing wave so that

like it's perfectly inside of this the field that you're trying to create. Yes. Yes. And this reminds me, all of what we

just discussed reminds me of something called simatics, which is sound creating just

structure and shapes. And when you look at them, I I don't know if you have what

are your thoughts on simatics and the shapes that get produced at various tones because it then takes this idea of

resonance and you put like, you know, if people aren't familiar, you put sand on like a metal sheet and they hit it with

certain uh frequencies and these shapes form, but it's not just like a triangle. It'll be like a circle and then like

kind of half circles on the outside, like very complex shapes form. So do you think that's just like a combination of

lower form sacred geometry shapes? Yeah, my first guess is that yeah, we're

looking at sort of a a a macro cosm or material layer that's that's uh

conformal to these patterns of the p but but all the the material whether it's

sand or dietimmacous earth whatever it is is simply revealing the patterns of

energy that are there. Right? I and and even if you if you

cleaned off the plate, the vibrations are on, those energy patterns are still

there. So I think yeah I absolutely I I think that you could go another level with that and it's that's a very

intriguing question you're asking there Ashton because perhaps that is uh the line of thinking is that uh the plasmas

are cohering to patterns of energy that you know are would ordinarily be

invisible but under the certain circumstances if you bring in two vibrating systems and they're in

resonance you can have this effect at a distance which seems to be one of the

most interesting phenomena associated with that. Um so yeah I I think you're

on the right track and I would love to talk about that further. Um I haven't

experimented I've witnessed people doing simatics. I've never really done it myself or studied into it. So I couldn't

tell you you couldn't show me a pattern and then I would be able to tell you okay that is this is particular

frequency. Um yeah, I think that the ideas a lot of this stuff are more of

just like to understand the concepts and imagine what could be you know it's like okay so now I realize we can we have

this self-organizing property that happen and then to your point you're saying well when we're dealing with

these plasmoids it's self-organization that we're seeing. So how do we explain

that? Well we look at simatics and we see self-organization happen at specific frequencies. we just use, you know,

general physics and waves and we go, "Oh, standing waves could be what we would need for that as well." Um, and

with plasma something, I don't know if you are familiar with a guy named Ken Shoulders. Um, Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yes. I I

got introduced to him through through Bendal. Yeah. And and there's a lot of people who have been researching his

work, and I think that his work might be the secret basis for Cold Fusion. Um,

Yeah. Yeah. I could I So what he found he found that he could just keep these

the charges separated. And the question people should be asking is if I have a plasma and a plasma is just an amorphous

blob like a gas. If I were to separate positive and negative charges, what would I think should happen? They should

come back together. They should equalize. And if it's just a gas, then theoretically nothing should be stopping

that from happening. Like that should just happen very quickly. But that's where Ken shoulders comes into play. Ken

Shoulders found no, for some reason these these negative electric electron charges are clustering together when

normally you would think they should just immediately dissipate and the plasma should just neutralize. And the crazy part about this is that if

you can take that effect and scale it up now you're making like a literal like

Zeus like lightning like you know that you can just strike down on a people and especially if you can stabilize it now

it's like okay I can just send it on somebody if I if I want you know that that to me seems kind of scary. Do you

think something like that is feasible? And then do you think the universe in general like do you believe in electric

universe or plasma universe theories? To the extent that I understand it, it

sounds like there are elements of it that are plausible, but I haven't up to this point. I have not really needed to

to to go there. Although I get asked so often that I feel like I need to take a

dive into it and really try to come away from it with some basic understanding. Absolutely though. Hell yes. the the the

definitely electro phenomena, electromagnetic phenomena is key to pretty much everything. Um I know though

that I think maybe where I've had some contention is I've studied into hypervelocity impacts a lot and so and

cratering and impact proxies uh that are created in the uh in the aftermath of a

of a major hypervelocity impact. what various densities uh will do, what

compositions will do, the difference between let's say a an iron asteroid, a condu uh condritic asteroid and a comet,

for example, how you can in the field detect the difference. So, I've had

people say, well, no, that is not impacts. Uh people who've not really studied what I've studied and so um you

know, they say that's not impacts. This is this is, you know, the electric universe. It's huge plasma bolts or

lightning bolts that that are have created those craters. Now, I would I would go, okay, that's an interesting

idea. It's worth looking at. You know, there's a whole lot of coherent evidence

though that really is consistent with hypervelocity impacts. We can look at some you know I've been to Meteor Crater

in Arizona and I what five times and you know you can look at the examine the crater morphology with to depth and

there you know it's totally consistent with the physics of a roughly 150 meteor

meter 150 foot iron asteroid. We know it was an iron asteroid because we find the

pieces of it laying all over the landscape. There's a hunk of the original thing sitting in the museum

there. Um so we have enough examples like that that we can we can derive a

lot of insight and information into the impacting process. Now is it a matter of either

or? I don't think so because one of the things that seems to be associated often times with uh hypervelocity impact

phenomena is you get electrical discharges very significant electrical

discharges particularly as this thing is passing through the atmosphere.

What's the role? I don't know. But, you know, it does seem that under certain

circumstances it may and of course lightning bolts, you know, you could you could describe a lightning bolt

essentially as a as a type of organized plasma. And so, yeah, so you've got this object

coming high, you know, might be moving at 15 to 20 miles per second, right? It's coming through the atmosphere and

it looks like it's discharging plasma bolts. Yeah, that seems to me to be very plausible. I don't know if you're going

to say though that this replaces the idea of, you know, a dumb space rock

hitting us because one of the things I've been doing since 1988. I got there was a very near miss in 1988. A a large

asteroid came quite close. It came within the orbit of the moon. And I thought, God, that's interesting because

by that time the ideas of hypervelocity impact were gaining more and more

credibility since the uh the hypothesis that the cretaceious tertiary dinosaur

era was terminated by the impact of a sixmile asteroid. And so I'd gotten interested

in that. I mean, I was one of those boys in the 50s and 60s that was obsessed with dinosaurs. Uh I lived and breed

dinosaurs. And one of the things that even even by the the early 60s even by

the late 50s there were some of the scenarios for the demise of the dinosaurs were getting dangerously

catastrophic and looking at major global upheavalss. So when in 1980 when the

Alvarez team came out with their research uh associating the worldwide aridium layer uh with a hypervelocity

impact, I found that very electrifying and uh at that point I began to get very

much uh very interested in in studying the phenomena of of of impacts. And so

by the time we get to 1988, uh, you know, we'd had a I'd had a quite

a a a time of realizing that, yeah, you know, space isn't this empty place like

we thought it was. It's it's densely populated. So 1988, there was a a near

miss and I started tracking those and there have been dozens and dozens of of

close flybys since then. Uh the last one major one was last June. Um it was

estimated to be 5 to 800 feet in diameter. Let me ask and it came well within and then you can continue on that

which is because one thing I want to say is that I plasma universe or electric universe does not say that oh you know

it's not replacing asteroids or meteors or anything like that is I think it's a big misconception is that people think

of it as like oh they're trying to rewrite everything. I think it's more of just realizing that there's an

electromagnetic basis to the universe, right? And and

see this manifest on large scales. And then the question I really want to ask is, do you do you think a space rock, a

meteor or asteroid could still take us out today? Do you think that they might have technology

powerful enough to stop one secretly? They don't really talk about this recently. They used to make movies about it all the time, like in the 2000s. just

haven't really talked about it. What do you think since you said you've, you know, looking? My first reaction would be I'd be skeptical. Uh I mean, they

they spent what a couple of billion dollars on the Dart mission to see if we could nudge an asteroid uh that was on a

collision trajectory with the Earth. Um I kind of thought at the time and

probably still would be inclined to believe that that represents the state-of-the-art. Um, are there

technologies that you know in the wings that could potentially be applied towards that in a in the very near

future? That I would say probably. So is anybody got it now? I would be

skeptical. But show me the evidence and I'll look at it with an open mind. Uh,

but let's say though that even in the situation where like I that's the thing though, we we don't even need something magical. We just need a small push,

right? and to see it far enough in advance and then even a small push is more than enough. So it's like I learned

that and tell me if you know anything different or any updates because I don't not very well read on this is that like

only certain ones that come from like I think the direction of the sun are like asteroids ones that we can't see because

the sun blinds us or something like that. So those are the scary ones but otherwise like we can kind of see them. Is that is that what you've heard? Oh

yeah. Yeah. I mean it certainly like the Tungusa event of 1908 that was probably a member of the Torid meteor stream and

it had a stream you picture it's an ellipse it's it's debris it's moving in

a circle between usually between Jupiter and the sun um and when it comes in it

makes a close passage by the sun called the perihelion uh so if we look at the torid stream our

earth's orbit intersects the torid stream twice. So it intersects it and

the earth is passing through that intersection point in late June, early

July and in late October, early November. Right now in the late October,

in fact, it interestingly peaks right around Halloween. So let's say on Halloween, Earth is passing through the

Torid meteor stream. At that point the the meteors are emanating from the

radiant point it's called out in space which just so happens to almost bullseye

on the the pletes which is traditionally the shoulder of the bull taurus and this

is why the name the torids. Well that stream comes in it goes around the sun

and then it c it's coming back out and in late June early July the earth

crosses the stream uh at that point. So if you're looking in the direction of

the arrival of these meteors, you are yeah, you're looking towards the sun. And this is why if you read some of the

eyewitness accounts of the Tanguska event of 1908, which occurred on June 30th, which is pretty much just the the

peak of the Torid meteor shower, and it came from the direction of the sun,

which is where the radiant point would have been at that point. So, its position in in the in the sky was

consistent with the torids. Its time of year was consistent with being a member of the torid uh meteor stream. The

eyewitness accounts are well, you'll read things like it looked like it was torn from the sun. Uh it was born out of

the sun, things like that because and and so had this thing crossed the

earth's path, let's say uh in the fall at around Halloween time, Yeah. If we

were looking upstream, we would have been looking away from the sun. So, we would have seen those, we could have

seen it coming in much sooner. But that's why in a sense it snuck up on us and nobody saw it coming until literally

5 10 15 seconds before the thing uh exploded. It came in at an oblique angle

to the atmosphere and as it's moving, it's, you know, moving at 12 to 15 miles

per second, something like that. The atmosphere literally doesn't even have time to get out of the way. So, it sort of piles up and it becomes just like,

you know, uh, if you dive off a high dive and you do a belly flop, you know, you feel you feel that impact of the

water because it's not moving out of the way, right? It's kind of like that. So,

it exploded. It didn't hit the ground. This is important. A lot of people don't aren't quite clear on it. It was It was

an aerial detonation. It did not hit the ground. Like if you go to the crater in Arizona, the famous one, which I always

recommend, do it. Go there, stand on the edge of this awesome circle, this I mean

this awesome bowl and the hole in the ground and realize that this is just a baby, a a cosmic speck that did this,

right? Well, it's interesting to contrast the meteor crater in Arizona and the Tangus event because Meteor

crater was an iron asteroid, highly dense. So it penetrates the atmosphere

and hits the ground before it explodes. Tungusa is low density, hardly more

dense than a piece of ice and it's coming in and it explodes roughly 5

miles up in the atmosphere. So you've got this pressure wave, the blast wave

radiating outward and then it hits the ground and when it hits the ground it does this. And so you have what is 80ome

million trees over 800 some square miles. flattened in a radial pattern

outward from where that blast wave intersected the ground and then went

radial from that point. That was like why those are the Sorry, finish your thought. Well, yeah, those are you can

think of those as almost like end points of a continuum and then you've got a whole bunch of stuff in between there um

that can have different effects. Yeah. Um, so I was going to say the the the destructive damage I think that's kind

of tangentally related to why they were afraid that like the atomic bomb might destroy, you know, take out the entire

ignite the entire atmosphere is that they can have this massive shock wave effect and this chain effect that can

happen. And when you mentioned the asteroids coming in and the reason why they detonate in the air, I think the

Chernobylisk one recently as well also detonated in the air. Um yes, they

actually use plasma for to prevent this from happening on hypersonic crafts. So

the reason why hypersonic crafts can achieve the speeds they can is they use a plasma sheath in front of them and

that's what reduces the drag and the friction which is pretty cool. Just fun note about plasma. Um but something I

want to go back to it's also kind of related to sacred geometry that you mentioned something about action at a

distance and waves out of phase. that sounded very Tom Beardenesque and uh I wanted to just

have you expand upon that because uh I've heard many people including Terren Howard and others talk about

phase conjugation like waves overlapping and I want to get your take on what it

means its significance and applications. Well, okay. So, uh Well, yeah. Okay.

Well, the main thing I think is that the action at a distance. Yeah. Un unless, you know, unless we got

down, we tried to talk about a particular medium of propagation. But it seems like, you know, if you have two

tuning forks and they're in resonant frequency, you can vibrate one and, you know, assuming they're within range, the

other one will vibrate. Yeah. at the same at a at a same frequency or a

multiple or sub multiple of the base frequency. So what is happening there? I

I couldn't explain it uh myself. Uh I know there's probably a physics explanation for it. Um yeah, I think the

answer is just that space is not empty that there really is an ether like Tesla said. Uh there really is an ether and

what we see there must be something else there. So there's an effect called the Aaronhoff bomb effect that shows that

even in the absence of electromagnetic fields there's still potentials like you

shoot this electron past this absence of electromagnetic fields and it gets shifted but it shouldn't. And this opens

the door to what you just said. You actually nicely explained it. That was a great analogy of using one tuning fork

over here vibrating and a second tuning fork just for some reason all of a sudden getting perfectly in phase with

it. And this is the concept of quantum communications. Uh actually Hal Pudof

explained this on Joe Rogan earlier today and I thought it was the best part of his conversation with Joe Rogan. He

has a patent for quantum communication system and he said the difficult part is

not sending the quantum message through the the basically invisible message. It

has no electromagnetic fields. The difficult part is decoding it. He said you need to have a decoder on the other

side so that basically like to your point that the tuning fork gets in resonance and then if you have this

resonance effect happen then you can read whatever you're sending over here

which I thought was pretty cool. So do you think that's the most important part about you know phase conjugation is

basically if if I had to put my finger on something I would say that sounds very

logical to me. Um, okay. Yes. I And yeah, and how do you trans

transform the frequency into something tangible? Until they work that out, I'm

not ready to get into a um a uh what do you call it? A

uh oh, what do they call it on Star Trek? Uh not a holiday. Remember when uh when

uh you know when whoever was being beamed up by Scotty? Yeah. What do they call that machine on

Oh, yeah. The transporter. Yeah. I'm not ready yet to get into a transporter yet.

Yeah. Not just yet. Yeah. And scaling it up. But I mean, you put the pieces together and you have to wonder why not

because we've seen quantum teleportation and they've got like records for it and

we're sitting here saying that the universe is scale and variant. So, you know, why can't you really scale

it up from that perspective? Now, let me ask you on the ancient

history side of it. Do you think ancient civilizations could have figured this these this this

ideas, resonance, physics, this stuff out? I mean, they may not have had the

material manufacturing that we have today, but could they still figured it

out and could they have used it? The one the I want to know if you can think of other ways or if you think that the the one thought I had was that maybe they

use sound because maybe if everything's just based on waves, maybe sound can create like a gravity effect and that

could like reduce the weight of a block or something like that. What What are your thoughts on ways that could Well,

yeah. I mean, I think you're definitely on the on the right track with the idea of sound. And I remember back in the

days when I still used to shave, I had an electric shaver and and uh you know,

I'd plug it in, if I turned it on and it was still on and I set it down on the countertop, it started moving

around, it started moving. And I remember thinking when I saw that, um, h

that's interesting. Could you use vibrations to move objects? And the

answer to myself seemed well, yeah, probably under the right circumstances, you could. And then as a builder,

uh, I've had some experience moving heavy weights, you know, heavy I beams

that weigh a ton or two. And I don't like within my small crew that I had at

the most back in the day when I was at my peak, I had 18 or 20 employees. And

you know, we would be out there and sometimes we'd have to hoist a a one- ton I-beam up two stories into place.

And we had all kind we had mechanical ways of doing that. And I often thought, God, you know, um, I wonder if these

guys, you know, because you see all over the world, doesn't matter, every continent virtually, we don't know about

Antarctica, but every other continent has examples of megalithic stonework where we're looking at stones anywhere

from like 10 to 100 tons. Right now, we build today, we use cranes to move a two

or three ton I-beam into place, right? We don't do it manually. It would be completely uneconomical. Stones. Yeah,

we'll use stones. I mean, you know, a lot of times now we just the stones we use are mainly veneer stones. We don't

build things with 10 ton stones. Why? Because it would be completely

uneconomical to do it. Shipping it there, getting it there, transporting it to the site, assembling it. How, you

know, what type of temporary support structure would you need? How you get it into place? Because obviously the

greater the weight, you run into this exponential problem where where you know in order to move something, the heavier

it is, the more uh the more resources you're going to have to devote to moving

it. So if you look at a man a modern building site, you've got a huge crane with a large boom way almost sitting off

site and that boom is moving stuff. Now if you don't have that crane, how do you how do you mobilize the manpower, the

the comealongs, the the le levers that you might be using? So my point is this.

It would be completely uneconomical today in in the modern day society to

build things out of 10 and 20 ton stones. Yet all over the ancient world,

they're doing that. And what would be uneconomical for us, I would think,

would be a hundred times more uneconomical for a a a

pre-industrial civilization. And yet they're doing it. They're doing it in Egypt. They're doing it in Malta,

they're doing it in Great Britain, they're doing it in India, they're doing it uh in South America. Uh

so if you told me that there's a there's some civilization, some culture somewhere that for whatever reason

they're obsessed with moving, you know, they've got too much testosterone or whatever and they're obsessed with

moving five and 10 ton stones. Okay, sure. Uh yeah, with brute force. with

brute force. And within the the the prehistoric cultural models, what have

they got to employ? Only brute force, right? Unless they've got some really

ingenious method of of of pulleys and uh comealongs and and levers and that kind

of thing, right? But even there, you're still relying ultimately on brute force. Well, it seemed to me that it just made

never made any sense. It just it doesn't add up that you would have multiple cultures all over the world apparently

quarrying and moving even 40 and 50 ton stones with impunity unless they had

some type of technological means for accomplishing that. Now, within the

framework of more conventional thinking, that's immediately dismissed as absurd without considering the alternative that

all of this is being done by brute force is probably even more absurd.

The assumption that doesn't it seem ahead like it's such a great point that

all these different places across the world, they're definitely not connected. Like it's not like they were talking to

each other. It's not like Gbecki was talking to Stonehenge. They all decide they're building these

huge monolithic structures with massive stone pillars somehow stacked on top of

other stones. Doesn't it seem like they're bragging? It's almost like they're saying, "Look

at what we are able to do going out of their way to do something. There's no need to do that. Just go live in a cave.

You don't need to build this massive thing out there, too." So, that's the other thing that I would throw out there is it almost seems like they're showing

us what they can do in that. How would you interpret that? Well, I I would totally accept that what

you just said. It doesn't explain to me how they're doing it. Yeah. But I know myself, look, I'm building on the site.

Uh, you know, the the clients, we're there in the morning, the truck comes and delivers some big I-beams, and the

client is there, the client leaves, and then the client comes back at the end of the day, and the I-beams are in place,

and they're like, "Oh, wow. How did you do that?" you know, well, we have our ways, you know, we

I say like, oh, well, yeah, how did that 50story building go up there? It's like, well, well, you know, they used modern

engineering. It's like, if I were to try have to do it, there'd be I'm not going to be able to figure that out. So, may I

think maybe it does imply though they have another method or their methods are just simply foreign to us and that's why

we couldn't figure it out. I don't know. Okay, so here's a possibility and I

offer this as hypothetically. Somebody's going to of course I offer things hypothetically and then there's always

going to be somebody who says, "Oh, Randle says it was this way and that way." And I'm going, "No, I'm putting this forward for consideration as a

possibility." Right? Okay. So, if we look into the mythology of many of these

cultures, they have very similar themes. is that somebody or something from

outside their culture, Egyptians, it's the whole pantheon of Egyptian gods. Where did

they learn agriculture? Where did they learn geometry? Well, it was from these outsiders. Who are these outsiders? I

don't know. But we find the same themes repeated over and over and over again where I used to go hiking up here near

where I live in North Georgia. There's a mountain up there in the southern Appalachian. It's called Blood Mountain.

And I don't think it's there anymore because I think it wore out and and and and disintegrated. But back decades ago,

there was a sign right at the trail head. And it was a Cherokee legend

because this area up there where I go hiking used to be the the the occupied

by the Cherokee. So they had this legend, right? And it was on the sign and it said on Blood Mountain. This is

they would go to Blood Mountain to communicate with the N or to to commiserate or or or to encounter the

Nunahai. The Nunahai that was spelled it translated into English nun nunahigh or

Nunahai. And basically they described the Nunahai as the people who could

travel anywhere. And I remember seeing that and begin well who are they interesting? Then you

know in my readings I come across the Anosazi, the Anunnaki, the Tuata Dean

and I'm looking and and this root is the same in all of these. And then you go to

Samaria, you've got the root Anu, and you have the same idea that Anu was the

god uh that taught all this stuff uh to mankind. So then my question is okay

I've spent a many many years exploring the myths of great floods and

delusions. Okay I've spent thousands of hours in the field. I've read hundreds

if not thousands of papers on the subject. Um and my conclusion obviously

is that uh behind the myths and the stories and whether it's Noah or Utnapishum or Dalian or Zissith or Manu

the list goes on in this it it's it's essentially the same thing that there

was these world destroying floods and in the oversimplified models of the people

who believe in this they're they're not looking for a naturalistic explanation supernatural is is will do the trick.

Well, we we don't need God created the flood. God is omnipotent. So, it's supernatural. We don't need a

naturalistic explanation. Uh but on the other hand, there is a naturalistic explanation. We

can explain how gigantic floods and when you come to understand the scale of what

what's implied by a peak discharge of half a billion cubic feet per second.

Well, if somehow by some quirk of fate, you were able to

survive in a region that was subjected to a half billion cubic feet per second

after in the aftermath, you would easily conclude that the world had been destroyed because your world, your

regional world was it was gone. It was right. My point I'm getting at is this.

behind the myths. There are real, we can say this unequivocally now, there are real events that we now know paleo

hydraology is a real thing and mega scale floods even approaching a billion cubic feet per second. We can now

document unequivocally that these level the scale of flood phenomena has occurred in large parts of the earth's

surface. Right? Well, let's extrapolate from that. Okay. If we can say that

behind one of the ubiquit most ubiquitous myths from the from the world

and and the flood myths are are ubiquitous from you know every inhabited

continent has myths of great floods. Okay. What's the other

uh mythology that has come down to us that's virtually as widespread and

ubiquitous is the this idea of the gods which then brings us to the question of who or what were the gods. And if we

were going to try to put that modern scholarship basically that's just an

artifact of the primitive mind. There's not anything real there. Um if there is

anything real it's the deification of somebody some pharaoh or somebody and

and that's the reality. Sure. Now, you know, and and so in in in the

fundamentalist view, it's you would say maybe substitute gods, you would substitute angels or archangels, but you

also have this concept of these beings that are of some type of a transcendental

nature or something that but I don't necessarily look at it that way. I I think of it this way.

Again, trying to reduce it down to AAM's razor. If we were faced with a global

catastrophe on the scale we our modern civilization faced with a global catastrophe on the scale of what

happened in that pleaene holysine transition particularly that window we

called the younger dus if that were to happen again today well I think we could

say without hesitation that 10,000 years down the road archaeologists would be

hardpressed to find evidence of our presence here our of our industrial

civilization which is pretty much the product the byproduct what two or three centuries of of cultural evolution right

scientific evolution. Yes. Now let me ask another question on that because I

want to I do want to keep talking about the ancient history and this reset stuff but I want I got to get your opinion

on another idea for what the gods could be. Aliens. aliens. So, I don't think I've

heard your opinion. What is your opinion on this disclosure phenomenon out there?

There was this hearing actually just today. They were talking about I don't know. They always talking about aliens

and the crash retrievals, what have you. What's your take on all of that coming from somebody who's, you know, more

focused on the ancient history and and and uncovering that side of it? Does it I mean I guess

let me feel it feels like kind of like a controlled op to me is what it feels like to me. Everybody's government

related so I'm just curious what your thoughts are. Well I I can definitely see that

dimension of it. A controlled op. I I can see that and I I could even see the motive for that. I mean, if you've got

uh, you know, DARPA or whoever is testing advanced technology and, you know, let's

let people go ahead and believe that this is aliens from Zeta reticular, wherever, right? Um, so that would be

kind of the AAMS razor. Let's get let's boil it down to the most fundamental thing that, you know, without going into

the exotic realms or exotic explanations first. Um, and does that make sense? I

think it makes sense in a lot of the cases, but not all of the cases. Um, you know, I recently read

Lou, you know, Lou Alzando. Yeah. Who he is? You read his book, right? Yes. Yes.

In fact, I think I've got it. Yeah. Right here. There's a part where he talks about the 23minute video with the orbs in a triangle formation. Actually,

that's very relevant to what we were talking about before. It might be plasma orbs in a equilateral triangle.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And yes, yeah. Okay. So,

well, I don't think everything they're saying is BS either. Like, I think that my opinion is it's more complicated than

that where it's more like they're telling us the truth that is not violating national security. But if you

take the implications of sacred geometry and like plasma specifically,

one of the things I found out from talking to US Navy engineer Salvatore Py

is that theoretically we can get past the ultraviolet paradox which

ultraviolet paradox says like classically look at quantum mechanics and we look at waves and frequency and

if we just increase the frequency we get more energy. But the ultraviolet paradox says no, at some point it actually just

cuts off. So you can't just increase energy to infinity. But the vibrational zero point energy

doesn't have that limitation. The structure of our universe just vibrates. So theoretically, you can just vibrate

the until you break a wine glass or what have you, however you want to think of it. Mhm. And so what that would mean is

if there are aliens and they figured out this, you know, zero point energy

technology based on sacred geometry, they might have access to unlimited energy, like infinite energy and we

might have it too. And now to me, I go, "Oh, oh, it's really about free energy.

It's not about aliens and stuff like that, you know." And that's what I want to know and what I want to delve into

you on that thought. I want to know first of all if you think that's possible and then if that is possible

what are the implications like could some of the the

re I know you're big into the reset theory and I by the way I totally agree I think that there's been resets do you

think that those resets there's some possibility or what is the possibility that they could be artificial resets

like that it wasn't just a natural phenomenon that you know somebody shot a rock at us or you know something like

that as Well, that's an interesting question, a

loaded question, I must say. But, uh, you know, I would tend towards thinking, you know, that there have been

numerous catastrophes now we can document that I think we could attribute to being entirely natural. Um, impacts,

uh, like for example, an impact into an ocean, uh, is going to be almost three times more likely than an impact into

land. impacting the ocean uh could create tsunamis that are hundreds of feet high when they make landfall. And

any kind of a coastal community, coastal civilization, unless you've got early

warning technologies in place, you're you're toast, you know, when that thing makes landfall. Um we go back to the ice

age with the lowered sea levels, 400 feet lower sea levels, now most of the continental shelves are exposed. During

the Ice Age, that probably would have been the optimum place to try to create a a a community to create have a

settlement would be along the coastlines because you've got access to marine uh resources and you've got access to

terrestrial resources. However, uh when you've got a 400t sea level rise, uh you

know, those coastlines are now under 400 ft of water. Yeah. So, and now the other

thing is is if let's say you do have even a relatively small bolide crashing into the ocean, if you've got a what's

going to happen is as as the wave propagates outwards from the impact point as as it goes into the shallows,

you know, what happens there is you've got when it's moving into deep ocean, you've got this wave that you could

think of as being, you know, hundreds hundreds of feet deep. And then when that moves in onto the shallows, what

happens is that water piles up. And so you can think of it this way, Ashton. If

you've got a steep if you've got a steep uh gradient at the coastline, that

you'll have a runup height could be 200 feet high, but it's run in distance is

going to be limited by the gradient of the coastline. If you've got a shallow

gradient like you would have had during the ice age when all the continental shelves of the continents are exposed

now when that 200 ft wave hits its run in could be dozens and dozens of miles

right because you got the slow you can picture that can't you got the wave coming in here its run in before it

reaches its distal point before it reverses and flows back out could be

many times further than if it's a steeper. So if you had a society living

on a coastline at the end of the last ice age, I think that it's very likely that they would be completely erased um

from any kind of existence um even without a bolite impact. That rise in

sea level is going to create tremendous amounts of energy that's going to be dissipated in the intertidal zone and

that energy is going to be enough to wipe out pretty much anything. I mean, we already know that the modern

coastlines are degrading considerably with because of sea level rise. You know, you can see videos online where

the, you know, the cliffs are collapsing into the water and carrying buildings and stuff with them. Well, during the

ice age, I think that the that the case for a multi-impact event is very strong. It's

very robust at this point. In fact, it may have been even I call it a and I'm

not I maybe didn't originate this term, but an epoch a an impact epoch where

you've got the disintegrated byproducts of some larger object that the earth

encounters multiple times during that phase between initial breakup and the

point at which most of the debris has now been uh has uh turned to to

basically cosmic dust or its most likely uh end point is going to be uh it falls

into the sun ultimately. That's where because a lot of times you I we're talking about Tunguska and we're talking

about the perihelion passage. Well, as as it each passage it'll it'll can be

drawn in closer to the sun. If you look at the crotzers which is a new family of

comets have been discovered there's they will orbit the sun. they'll be seeing orbit the sun, but their ultimate uh

destiny is that they fall into the sun and they get consumed by the sun. So,

let's say here's a model. You've got a large comet comes into the inner solar system from the zone outside of Neptune

like the Kyper disc, um which is hypothetical, but it's almost certainly a real thing. And we won't get into why

we know that based on probabilistics, but it's almost certainly a real thing. And so if a comet is delivered from the

Kyper disc into the inner solar system, it's going to lay in close to the plane of the ecliptic, which is the orbital

plane of the planets, it then begins to undergo a hierarchy of disintegrations. And then it'll go through a first level

disintegration. Then it'll go through a second level. And each time it makes a close passage like a a a paraj Jovovian

passage close to Jupiter or a a close passage by the earth, the gravity field

will cause it further break up and further disruption. The ultimate the ultimate final state of it is is going

to be dust if it's not swept up into into a planetary or the sun. Right? So

now it may take several millennia for that whole process to to to complete

itself. During that millennia, if that stuff is in an earth in an ecliptic

orbit, yeah, the earth is going to be highly vulnerable to encountering the byproducts of that event, of that

disintegration process. So until that material then clears out of the orbital

plane, we could be vulnerable. And I think that the model now supports that. I think that for example at the end of

the last ice age where there was an a vulnerable period that maybe lasted 3 to 4 thousand years and ultimately it was

the break up of a large comet whose spawn is what we now call the torid

meteor stream that I mentioned earlier. Yeah. that just wiped out a lot of people. So yes, um let me ask a

different question on it. Let's assume that there is this um resonance-based,

let's just call it Tesla based technology and that some ancient civilizations kind of had some form of

it. Do you think it's possible that over a thousand 2,000 years like humans or

societies maybe secret societies or something like that could have been could have kept this information and

passed this information down over the years without it like mainstream? You do. Can you elaborate on that? I do.

Yeah. How do you think and and like I guess who do you think might have done that or what have you? Because I know there's been I mean honestly I don't

know much about it or what have you and I this isn't meant to attack you. I'm not trying to I I know that you're some

people say you're what a 33 degree Mason. I don't know what any of this stuff means, but I'm just curious. I

went I went through the Scottish right years ago, which is up to the 32nd degree. Oh, okay. Got it. But I've not

I've not been active in the Scottish right, although I've studied pretty deeply into the symbolism. But does this

mean you're a little or I don't know what uh Okay, got it. No, no, you're not

a reptilian. There's so much. Okay. Just uh Well, I sometimes get in a reptilian

mood. I do. Uh actually, uh but no, as far as I know, I I'm I'm not reptilian.

So, which of the secret societies that are hiding that could have hidden the technology then you think? Oh, we could

go back. We could talk about the uh the Dianician artificers, the Ellisians, the

Roman collegium, the Komachines, the the Martinists. uh killed somebody during

Oh, I'm sure they do. Yeah, I'm sure they do. Um although, you know, I I've heard

interesting things that I I can't prove. Uh yeah, you know, about the Vatican

Library. I I know somebody who actually visited the Vatican Library and said, "Yes, there's an extraordinary amount of

stuff there that they've preserved. Maybe someday they'll see fit to kind of begin to open the vaults a little bit. I

would sure like that." Um but yeah, I mean you mentioned the Freemasons. The Masons are sitting on a huge repository

of symbolism that's basically come down from the middle ages. The same symbolism that was encoded into the Gothic

cathedrals. You know, it's been said that Chart Cathedral is the golden book of the west that it is a textbook in the

ancient science. And once you begin to look at it, you you begin to think that,

yeah, that actually seems believable because, you know, we could take that as a as a a a type case where you've got a

situation where you you know, you've just come out of 300 years of the so-called dark ages, which began like in

the 500s with literal darkening, probably multiple volcanic, closely

spaced volcanic eruptions. uh literally filled the atmosphere with so much stuff

that the sun wasn't coming through. I mean that really does look real. That's not some exotic thing fringe idea.

That's a very real idea. In fact, there's many ways to that we can demonstrate that. But it look literally

looks like there was a series of events that plunged the earth into a period a

300year period of cold weather. It caused repeated agricultural failures

which caused food shortages which led to famine. Famines led to people being mal

malnourished. Weak immune systems got weak. And then we see that typically

historically uh pandemic diseases like the Justinian plague or the bubanic

plague are associated with this decline in global temperature. the the it the

cold weather brings on agricultural failures which then leads to hunger and so on. It's almost like dominoes, right?

So come around between 900 and 1,000 AD, the things cleared up and the planet

warmed. The sea ice in the North Atlantic receded way back and opened up the sea lanes between north northern

Europe, Iceland and between Iceland and Greenland. And so that's when we had the

migration of uh Vikings for example all the way to Greenland and settling and

producing farming agricultural colonies on Greenland where now it's perafrost

right so during this period it was warm well one of the consequences of that was

that you had 100 to 150 years of abundant agriculture in Europe and it

means people were having enough to eat The population grew uh infant mortality

declined. Even the stature of European peoples increased by 3 to 4 in on

average because they were now getting wellfed. So the other consequence was this enormous expansion of population.

So now come to 1130. Okay, we've had a century and a half of optimum climate,

abundant agricultural harvests, growing expanding population, but people are

still basically living almost a f feudal existence. Feud dal, not futile, a

feudal existence. You know, uh, primitive agriculture. But now we get to 1130 and something

very interesting happens. Construction begins on the first high

Gothic Cathedral Notream at at St. Dennis. Right within 10 to 20 years,

you've got dozens of these massive cathedrals coming up out of the ground.

Right now, each of these cathedrals is like a quantum innovation over and above

what preceded them. You look at the simple structural methodology of a Roman-esque. It's completely primitive

next to the high Gothic vault, the Olgival vault, which literally has the

stones. They've come up with a they came up with a an innovation into mortar. So

that the mortar they used was as strong as the stones itself. So the difference between here

now is you've got a structural system that's under tension in in a Gothic vault. You've got this resonant chamber

beneath that ogal vault. It's all pure sacred geometry. You have because of the

fact that you've you've got this innovation of the flying buttress. Uh how can I explain that? Let's see if

I've got something here. I'll just take this. Let's here's here's a here's one

of the arches of your vault. You maybe would have two of them, you know, meet meeting. You can picture like this,

right? So, what they're going to want to do is is the forces are actually it's

being held in the the the flying buttress is actually providing a low a lateral force against the base of the

vault. If you were to remove the flying buttress, the vault's going to do this. Yeah. Okay. That is a very innovative

engineering system. Now, so you're saying major innovations that

potentially were being passed down. Is that what you're implying that we're or you know chasing? Well, then the mystery

is is passed down from where? Because it seems like it was born whole cloth out

of nothing. There doesn't seem to be any gestation. It's just there. Yeah. Came out of

nowhere. That's you could almost say that it came out of nowhere. But see, it even go it goes further than that. In

order to build one Gothic cathedral, you have to have this enormous organization

of highly skilled people. Yeah. You have to be able to go and quarry the stones and they have to be chosen with care.

You cannot have fracture lines in the stone. The whole process quaring the

stones, preparing the stones, the the sculptural programs, the stained glass.

Exact. Yeah. Everything. It's like, well, kind of like almost going back to

our uh metaphor of the crop circles. It's almost like you had to have the entire army in place, highly trained,

ready to go. Somebody blows the whistle and boom, it it begins and for the next

150 years, you've got 80 of these incredible structures going up. chart,

uh, Notradam, Leyon, uh, Amian, Reams, Bourjier, on and on these incredible

structures. And if you haven't put that on your bucket list to go travel over Europe and visit some of these

cathedrals and and it's just mind-blowing and and and then as quick as it started, it ended. Huh. It it

ended in the late 1200s, early very early 1300s. And what's interesting is

that warm period came to a sudden end. And in in the 1330s to 1340s, you had

multiple a actually earlier than that, you had a whole series of cold years

where agriculture failed. You had crops dying in the fields. You had frosts that were

coming in the middle of the summer. And it took about 30 years for this declining weather to catch up. But the

end result was is that yeah, you had mass starvation. And that mass starvation is what preceded the onset of

the bubanic plague. And once you had the bubanic plague, it was done with because there were places where half the

population of Europe was wiped out. You didn't have the labor force anymore. Yes. And you didn't have the labor force

in that what's called the late antiquity ice age, the late antique little ice

age, which was from the 500s to the 900s. That was the dark age. Then that

was preceded followed by the the warmth of the climatic optimum, the little ice,

the the the the medieval warm period. And it's like they were ready, assembled, and they they exploited this

opportunity, this window of opportunity where you had enough people. How they got them trained and

ready, I don't know. That's one of the really interesting mysteries of the rise of Western civilization, but they did.

And then when the climate uh crashed in the late 12 early 1300s, that was when the great Gothic

building boom came to an end. Now there was still sporadic building went on for

hundreds of years but not anywhere near that scale say between the late 11 and

and the early 1200s. So, so how do you explain that? Unless there was somebody

who had had a system and they were in effect

almost waiting until like I know myself when I built something I have to have a

a a labor a a pool of labor I can draw on. If I don't have that I can conceive

of anything but I'm not building anything. You want to know what's weird about that is that another thing about Hal Pudof today. It was this he was

talking to Joe Rogan about you should listen to this part the quantum communication near the end of the

interview. And what was weird about it was that Hal Put has these patents since

the 1990s that is a quantum communication patent with no electromagnetic field.

And I've been wondering well what's the deal with this patent? He got it approved like five times since then.

Well, he explained today what it was is he said he well at least you know this is if you believe the his public facing

story he says he put it on the back burner because the material science hadn't gotten to a point yet where it

could actually like be put into practice and so now you think about this and you go huh so this theory then is that maybe

imagine a scenario where he saw a UFO something that was impossible for us to build and was like oh I know how this is

happening we just can't build it yet and Now he's going and now what's he doing right now? He's going back to the

quantum communication thing because now the you know presumably our like uh what

do they call it like the manufacturing lithography I think they call it lithography like making little microchips. It's getting good enough now

where they can like do really crazy stuff. So that does kind of present the idea of like what if there was you know

a group that was had this in knowledge to make this plan for engineering but

didn't have the the right resources to be able to put it in place but then population gets big enough now they go

okay we got the people to make it happen right cool well yeah that's kind of I'm I'm

putting that out there as a as a hypothetical scenario which to me

explains it as well as anything because there's really no other explanation it makes any sense. Yeah. Um you don't

instantly, you know, obviously like the skill level on one of my projects wouldn't be anywhere near what and the

level of organization, but of course if I build a house, I've got an entire

society. We might order windows from, you know, up in Wisconsin. We might be

ordering getting tile from Italy. You know, without that, what am I doing? I'm

using local stone, local timber, whatever it might be, earth. Um but then to be able to go from almost

like working on that level to building a cathedral that is a quantum leap in a

way there. See and I think that we could I think your

stories like you know you you've got good stories that kind of really rationalize and that's something I've wondered is about those cathedrals.

never did that before we we we talked here today. And I want to ask, let me bounce another one a theory I have off

you since you're really the expert on ancient history stuff is is that I think my biggest fear for what the answer to

this whole disclosure UFO alien thing is would be a scenario

where there is this advanced technology and maybe we've been talking about the basis of it frequency energy vibration

plasma etc. That is just another echelon up. And the downside of it would be that

if you achieve that level of technology, you would just automatically at some

point wipe yourselves out. Like somebody wip does presses the button that ends us all and wipes us all out. And the reason

why this scares me is that I asked the question, why would somebody hide information? Why would you hide

technology? like what would be the bad thing about technology and then I just take it to its extreme and I go oh well

if you know you look at the atom bomb and you say well what if we can do something that's a million times or infinitely more powerful than that and

so my theory is well we maybe made a conscious decision to say you know what

we see the writing on the wall that we're going to get to a point where it's just too dangerous and we say let's just make ourselves dumber I think it was

actually the show Battlestar Galactica I think is the theory where they just like

shoot their spaceships into the sun and they're like, "Okay, bye technology. We're going to go live on this planet."

Like I don't know. What do you think that could be something that would be? Well, you know, I have a sort of a

romantic growing up in a pastoral rural environment in Minnesota. I have this

kind of emotional connection with living out there and close to nature, you know,

where as a kid I could sit in my back, we had property on a lake. I could sit in my backyard and fish. you know, there

was hunting all around. There was, you know, farms that were growing food and it was, you know, so I I really I have

this sympathy, this sympathetic resonance for that kind of uh edic

existence right in my genes because that was sort of where I grew up.

I believe we need technology because based upon what I have seen uh in my

studies on catastrophism is that well let's take an example look at a couple

the couple of the look at the the great uh tsunami that happened in Indonesia was it 2003 where there was over 200,000

people killed um yeah that's horrible and then you look at you look it was horrible but there was no early warning

system there was no technology in place to tell these people what was happening. Come back a few years later, you had an

equally large destructive tsunami that hit Japan, remember? But the fatalities

of that were minuscule compared to the Indonesian tsunami. Why? Because there

was technology in place. So if I look at it that way now, does technology uh have

a a dual side? Yes. I mean, obviously you you mentioned the atomic bomb. I

think let me say this from what I my understanding now of plasma technology

is that if you look at the atom bomb and you look at the burning of fossil fuels anything like that you're looking at

explosive technology where where the organized matter is being torn apart the

or it disintegrates. Um whereas in plasma technology it seems it's the

opposite. you're you're actually creating organized coherent systems and

many of those seem to be integral to life processes you know because we'll

use the example of the so-called uh divine proportion and I certainly understand why some of the the the

geometers of the middle ages referred to it you know Kepler referred to it as one of the great treasures of geometry and

we find it infused in all living systems and we find it in in the the the the the

cosmic domain, we find it in the microcosmic domain. Uh and we find it in the human domain in the domain of

life. I don't know what why that is other than it seems to be inherent within the geometry itself because when

you have these dynamic forms, they have this potential of infinite infinite

replicability either in an expanding scale or a contracting scale. And in the

geometry courses that I do, I show you know it's hands-on. Here's how you do it. Here's how you can reproduce this

particular form infinitely. Um, just depending on the scale that you can

operate, you know, now in the human scale, obviously there's limitations to how big you can go and there's limitations how small you can go. But

when you go into the microscopic scale or the cosmological scale, we find the same repetitive patterns emerging on

those levels. So, I got plenty examples of of molecular structure in which these

geometric forms. I mean look at the DNA molecule. It's it's basically the the uh

it's a pentagon and it's a hexagon united in a certain way. Um there's many

examples like that. So I think that there are technologies that are life

destructive and there are technologies that are lifeenhancing. My impression of what I've seen of the

plasma technologies is that they can be much more conducive to a creating an

organized system. Uh which is basically what isn't that what separates a living from a non-living system is the the

level of of organization in it to some extent. Well, so what I would say is

this like you mentioned the fractal nature of the universe which I think is huge as well and that's why I think sacred geometry is so big is that you

can take a simple shape like a triangle and you just stack it on and now you add this fractal pattern and it becomes more

and more complex and you increase complexity and if you look at plasma in outer space they put like little grains

of sand in it and it actually will form spiral galaxy shapes. It will form

double helix formations just naturally in outer space as well. Which, you know,

this is why I say like plasma seems to be like the one of these kind of base

forms of what we see in the universe. To your what you said about explosions, what I would say is the way

I would phrase it is an explosion is an exothermic release of energy. And what

we're now kind of brooaching on is this idea of an endothermic event, an

absorption of energy. In quantum mechanics, this would be taking your energy level, your your ground state,

and going lower in the energy state. And now this is what we would call you could be it's considered negative energy. It's

still just energy, but you're going negatively down instead of going up at a higher excited energy level. And what

Salvatore Pais referred to this as would be a nonradiative energy, which would

mean that if you were to look at it in a thermal, you're not going to see this white hot flash cuz it's not a explosion

release of energy. This might be the secret to the UFO phenomenon. if they are using this plasma and there's this

opposite nature that's not explosion and and this is you know tr

truly my belief is that this is what I think Ken shoulders figured out what I think many other people have figured out

about this plasma is just like this inversion effect to it that and I think

it's being kept secret for national security because it's not just gravity manipulation it's not just uh it's it's

also free energy it's figuring out fusions, figuring out how to make a sun like in the palm of our hand. And so

this is my last question for you, which is the question I kind of ask everybody now is

that now that we put all this together. We've got the there maybe there's this technology that's being hidden from us.

Sacred geometry, plasma, put it together. Maybe we've got this advanced technology that's out there. Let's

assume that there's this hyper advanced technology that's out there that can mean warp drives, free energy, medical

cures, potentially reversing the aging process would be a real implication.

You have a choice. You can have all of that stuff

or you can you have you can keep it hidden. The thing you have to give up is

I say free will, but what I mean is your privacy, your individ individuality.

Like the only way we can contain all of that power and be a society that functions is one where we reorganize our

entire society in a new way that's not based around capitalism potentially. We

have no scarcity anymore. So you have and anyone every the techn is so

dangerous that anybody could destroy the whole planet with a push of a button. So we have to make sure we're monitoring

everyone all the time to make sure that nobody does it. What would you choose? Would you take the technology and give up all

those freedoms or would you say you know what I'm going to pass that technology

away. I like fishing out in the lake in Minnesota by the way. I'm also from Minnesota. If Oh you are. Okay. So, uh,

if that was the choice, yeah, I would probably go with fishing by the lake.

You know, if that was the choice. You got to convince me though that there's not a third choice in there somewhere.

You know, here's the thing. So, I don't know that there not necessarily is, but I'm just sitting here and I've seen

super advanced technology. I'm convinced they've got this stuff that's out there and I just keep asking myself, why? Why

are they hiding it, right? Why hide the information? Why do this? if it could just make the world a better place. And

this was another thing Halpov said on Joe Rogan today is that he was part of the group in the early 2000s or

something under Bush where they got sent in and were like, yep, we've got super advanced technology and aliens exist and

all this stuff. So you guys are going to be the ones to figure out like are we ready for it? And so they write down on

a list like all the things like oh well it'll crash the stock market because like all these industries will just

become like obsolete instantly. Oh, people are gonna have like panic attacks and like freak out and like have

psychological meltdowns. And they did all this stuff and at the end of the day, they all came up with negative

numbers like different independent groups. And so they basically decided we

can't handle it. Like it's just it's too much for us. And they also decided that

well how do we release it without our adversaries getting it? Because also if that technology would be so powerful

then it's a you know we can't let we can't Russia can't have it China can't you know how American exceptionalism is

you know so for me that would be the only reason why they really would hide

it at the end of the day it must be something so big so dark like another

theory would be like oh we let's say we unlock this technology and everybody now

has free energy device at their home well what if the alien Ian or whatever the overlords are out there that have

unlimited technology themselves, they instantly detect that we've reached this level of technology. Kind of like in

Star Trek when the the what's the thing that the moment that a civilization

reaches warp drive, that's when they're like allowed to be contacted and so like the civilization comes out. But what if

the aliens come out of everywhere? Like they just teleport in out of everywhere

and just say, "Oh, you guys have reached the threshold where you're too powerful now. wipe you back down now to zero, you

know. And that's where I kind of I wanted to talk to you today. I'm glad we got to talk about this because I go, "Oh, that's pretty scary because yeah,

you imagine remember that you were talking about that huge asteroid event or that meteor event that was really

long." Like to us that could just be we imagine that was just a natural event that occurred. But to a civilization

that's advanced enough, that's just like flicking a rock towards the that's like stepping on an antill, you know, like

oops, I stepped on that antill. know about you know what you just said that's interesting because and I did I I didn't

mention it earlier but we're not that far I mean we're not that far away right

now from having the technology where we could redirect an asteroid yep to take

out a city if we wanted I mean you know we could probably be you know 20 years from now I think we could have the

technology to do that if you know but you know I look at

basically competition the history of competition ition amongst nations. What's driving, you know, if if we take

religion out of the equation, I think what we're left with is most competition between nations is based upon control of

resources. I mean, that's why, you know, that's what's behind the whole Ukrainian

conflict. You've got 11 to13 trillion dollars worth of resources in eastern

Ukraine. Who's going to control that? Well, if Ukraine goes NATO, the West controls it. The US controls it. If the

eastern Ukraine, the Donbas and Daetsk regions, which are mostly ethnic Russians, if they go, you know, rejoin

Russia, which is what they want to do, then Russia basically controls those resources. And now, apparently, from

what I've heard, we've just, you know, signed some deal with with Ukraine that

we're going to jointly develop those resources. And that to me is, well, that's yeah, that just proved to me what

this conflict is ultimately all about. Um, and that doesn't really resolve the

competition. But on the other hand, if we had a way of of of resource

utilization that was uh you know exponentially beyond which I believe we

do. I believe these technologies could basically solve the problem that's you

know beset us since civilization began which is the the conflict the competition for resources and

essentially space. If we when I say I'm not talking about space out there. I'm talking about land space, right? Because

if we look at when when warfare certainly begins to show up in the in

the record where we see the evidence of of conflict with with weapons and it's

interesting that they shows up around between five and 6,000 years ago during the climatic optimum. There's very

little evidence of human conflict. Why? Because for one thing, post ice age

human populations had been reduced enormously and you had uh uh you had a

whole getting back to the term you've used reset. We had a reset where we

suddenly had nature reset. The the top of the food chain has been decapitated

basically. So now you've got this proliferation of small game, climatic optimum, two degrees warmer than now,

abundant rainfall for 3,000 4,000 years. This is I would interpret as the time of

being fruitful and multiply. You know, be fruitful and multiply, replenish the earth because the earth has

been, you know, destroyed basically during this transition phase. So now we

get to 5 to 6,000 years ago and the climatic optimum as it's called gives

way to the uh to the neoglacial. And what happens with the

neoglacial is the world very rapidly cools off by a couple of degrees. Well,

this does several things. It causes the the the the altitude of uh like tree

lines and agriculture to uh drop by about a thousand feet depending on

topography, depending on latitude, sometimes more than that. The agricultural belt contracts enormously.

You have agricultural failures in Scandinavia, in in the British Isles.

And now we have and and during this climatic optimum population has has been booming

right now suddenly we have this uh drastic reduction of available resources

and to right there commensurate with that you see human conflict. If you're if you're a community that's been living

at 10,000 ft above sea level and you're farming and then the temperature cools

off by two degrees and suddenly you lose six weeks of of of growing season and

suddenly you don't even can't even practice agriculture anymore. You have to go down to the valley. Well, there's

already people living in the valley. So now you get conflict. I think what we need to be looking for is a way of to

create abundance where we're where our resource base is so vast that we uh that

there's no point in having conflict anymore. I you know I look at you know as a builder I sometimes I look at

things like you know I visited Grand Culie Dam and and Hoover Dam many times

very impressed by the scale the scope of that and I'm looking at Grandi Dam this

huge thing that's you know 500 ft high and a mile and a half wide the largest

concrete structure in North America and I'm thinking you know we couldn't have built that in the 1800s but we could

build it in the 1930s. Why? because we now had the industrial base and we had the labor force that we could pull.

However, when the government uh under Franklin Roosevelt first wanted to let out contracts, there was no existing

contractor in the country capable of taking on that project by themselves. So

what ended up happening was you had the three top uh building firms, engineering firms,

construction firms in the US forming a joint who had been competitors forming a

joint venture and only through that collaborative approach were they able to pull this uh project off like they did.

I think we're kind of in an analogous situation. I would personally rather do

a joint venture with Russia than go to have a nuclear war, World War III with

Russia if I had the choice. Right now, I'm I've been, you know, I grew up I

came of age during the the the the Mercury, Gemini, and Apollo programs. Right? And even during the Vietnam War

when I was very very critical uh and antithetical to what the government was doing, I was proud of our space program.

I followed it. My generation followed it. And I believed that it was going to continue on at that pace that we were

going to have, you know, an international base on the moon, that we were going to use that to explore the solar system. You know, I saw the

projections that we could conceivably get to Mars by the 1980s,

etc., etc. Well, we kind of got sidelined. Uh, you know, for one thing, Nixon shut down the Apollo program

because of the Vietnam War debts. He was looking for money to pay off the Vietnam War debt. So what he did, he he he he uh

sidelined the whole fleet of Saturn rockets that we had built when they're still operational, right? So I'm of the

mind that I would rather see like let's the US, Russia and China get together

and take on this extraordinary challenge of building uh an international base on

the moon from which we can now begin to harvest the infinite resources of the

solar system. Yeah, I would see that as being a a preferable alternative to this

Malthusian view of, you know, because what's the what what's the alternative? We go down fighting over diminishing

resources. We have to have all the things you were describing earlier about having controls of through consumption.

um you know if we're going to control energy we're talking about the whole chain from from extraction to

distribution to consumption and every every aspect every part of that has to

now be rigidly controlled. I don't think we need to go down that road

and so I would just say on that is that you can't put the genie back in the bottle when it comes to technology. You

know it's like going to advance no matter what. And I here's the scary part

is that if we do assume there is this super advanced technology, then how do we approach it? I thought you brought a

good point up is like is it whoever gets it first just wipes out everybody else? Like that's pretty sick. We're not going

to that's can't live like that. That's not realistic, right? So then the other option is we're going to have to figure

out a way where we all work hand in hand to take this technology and go to the

next level. And then the other part and I think I love that you're thinking about I think other people should I

think this is a good thought to just end it on let people think about is you know this technology I agree I think this

technology can end scarcity uh especially Bob Greener it's not even just free energy through cold fusion

it's also transmutation so we're actually talking about Star Trek replicators being something in our

future and then what I would ask people is what does our civilization even look

like in a post scarcity world where everybody is a Star Trek replicator. You

know, that's I think what our future is. So, Randall Carlson, sir, thank you so

much for being on my podcast. Go ahead and shout out any projects or anything you're working on or website or anything

like that. Sure. Uh Randall Carlson.com. Uh that's the simplest. Um

what's coming up? Of course, I'll be at the cosmic summit in June if you're familiar with that. And George Howard,

are you going to be there? Yeah. Heck yeah. Let's hang out. Oh, awesome. Good. Well, we get to hang out a little bit,

right? Yeah. Well, I wanna I want to get a little bit more dig into your Minnesota background. Oh, heck yeah. So,

um we'll have a chance there. But, uh week and a half, I what is it, the 11th? I'm doing a a myself and Brad Young,

we've been working together for years and we're doing a tour of the great Bonavville flood which is one of the

great floods in the history of the world that started in Utah near Salt Lake City

and it uh flowed through created the Snake River Canyon and ultimately flowed into the it's part of the Columbia

wershed and it is an epic story and some of my previous tours we've been looking

at at flood events in other areas of the country, Washington, Oregon, uh,

Montana, Idaho. This one, what we're doing is we're connecting some of the

there are independent studies of these various diluvial events. What I'm doing

is trying to show that they're connected. That the Bonavville flood and the Missoula flood are not two distinct

separate events. They're both part of a much larger event. So, we're going to be doing this and I think there's three

three seats left. I think the last I heard they may have sold out by now. Um

but yeah, we're going to convene in Salt Lake City and then we're going to tour some amazing landscapes in Utah and

Idaho. So, I got that coming up and then the cosmic summit. Then hopefully over

the summer I'm not going to have a lot to do because I'm trying to finish this book I've been working on for three

years now and it's just ridiculous um that it's drug out this long. But I keep

you know I keep getting drugged away into these things and I just got back from Sedon. I was out there a conference

uh headlining with Graham Hancock. Oh yeah. And Yeah. Yeah. Graham and I have become good friends over the years. I

contributed to his uh book, Magicians of the Gods, and I there's several chapters

in there about the great post terminal ice age floods that I was able to contribute to and guide him through some

of these landscapes. So, yeah, thank you guys both for all the work that you I'm a huge fan of Graham Hanco, fan of your

work as well. I I think that every I I just love the people that are doing their own work that are pushing the

boundaries that are, you know, doing their own investigation and then finding and challenging preconceived notions

that are out there. So once again, uh Randall Carlson, thank you very much for being here. I appreciate it. Thank you

very much for having me and I hope we can do it again. Yeah, sounds great.